Talent Acquisition for Contractors 🛠️
Paul Sanneman, founder of Contractor Staffing Source, discusses the real reasons behind the construction labor shortage, emphasizing speed and efficient hiring funnels. He shares strategies like the '10-minute rule' for securing top talent and explains why traditional headhunter models are outdated. Learn how to fix your hiring process and build a strong team.
Chapters
00:00
Hiring Crisis in Construction
Introduction to the problem of hiring in the construction industry.
01:53
Paul Cinnamon's Background
Paul Cinnamon's background and the founding of Contractor Staffing Source.
03:25
The Real Hiring Shortage
Debunking the myth of a labor shortage and addressing contractor's hiring practices.
06:10
Myths About Recruitment
Key myths and misconceptions about recruitment in the construction industry.
09:37
Proactive Hiring Strategies
Strategies for becoming proactive in hiring and adopting a marketing mindset.
11:52
AI-Powered Hiring Process
Leveraging AI and a step-by-step process for effective hiring.
19:04
Hiring All Levels of Staff
Discussing the scope of services offered by Contractor Staffing Source.
19:37
Offshore Labor and VAs
The rise of offshore labor and virtual assistants in construction.
22:22
Private Equity in Construction
Private equity's entry into construction and its implications.
24:52
When to Hire Us
When contractors should reach out to Contractor Staffing Source.
27:30
Final Advice and Wrap-up
Final thoughts and advice for contractors on hiring and business growth.
Transcript
00:01
If you waited four days to call back a homeowner who wanted a half million dollar remodel, you deserve to lose that job.
00:09
So why are you letting skilled project managers and lead carpenters sit in your inbox for a week before you reply?
00:16
We talk about margin fade on the job site constantly, but the biggest leak in your business isn't your estimate, it's your hiring funnel.
00:25
Today I'm sitting down with Paul Cinnamon, the founder of Contractor Staffing Source.
00:30
He's disrupted the industry by treating applicants exactly like high value sales leads.
00:37
We're going to break down why the labor shortage is actually a speed shortage and how to fix it, the 10 minute rule that secures top talent before your competition even opens their emails and why paying a headhunter a 20% commission is a legacy model that is killing your overhead.
00:58
So if you're tired of the panic hiring warm bodies, this is the system you need to build a bench.
01:04
Welcome to beyond the Bid.
01:07
Let's get after it.
01:11
You're listening to Beyond the Bid, the show by GO First, where we share the systems, strategies and practical AI for builders.
01:17
Keep listening to learn how to win more of the right projects, boost profitability and scale.
01:22
Beyond the Bid.
01:23
All right.
01:23
And we're live.
01:24
Welcome in.
01:25
Paul.
01:26
Appreciate.
01:26
Thank you for having me.
01:27
I appreciate being here.
01:28
Yeah, yeah.
01:29
So welcome to beyond the Bid.
01:31
I know we had a chance to just chat about a few things earlier, but, today we'll be really talking about, like, your bread and butter, which is, staffing and talent acquisition.
01:40
Okay.
01:41
Lovely world of and home builders.
01:45
Yeah.
01:46
Really good at it.
01:47
Yeah, Yeah, I know you.
01:49
You've definitely been in the.
01:51
Been in the game for a long time.
01:53
but for those who, who aren't familiar, can you kind of give just a quick 30?
01:56
Well, I'll give you a quick, quick background.
01:58
Okay.
01:59
I've been a business coach for 50 years.
02:01
Long time.
02:01
Right.
02:02
and I've worked with a couple thousand clients over the years, and I literally spent120,000 hours on doing this.
02:08
What happened about seven years ago was I could get businesses from like, a million to, 20 million, but they couldn't find employees.
02:15
I said, how hard can that be?
02:17
Found the software, getting the software.
02:19
They screwed up, didn't have time to do it.
02:21
Fine.
02:21
Put a guy in my garage.
02:22
I said, I want you to do recruiting for my coaching clients.
02:26
Right.
02:26
Fast forward to today.
02:27
There's, I think, Last count, there's 44, 47 people on the team.
02:31
We've hired 4 or 5,000 people in the last five, six years.
02:34
We have a 94 success rate that people would last longer than a year.
02:37
A typical week for me, Grant, is we go through 6,000 resumes, send a thousand interviews, do 500 videos, and hire 10 to 20 people.
02:46
That's a typical week for us as it's pretty extensive.
02:49
So, yeah, sort of.
02:51
I mean, you got to go through, literally, you know, we went through 6,000 to find 20, right?
02:55
Yeah.
02:56
6,000 to find 20.
02:58
Yeah.
02:58
That's crazy.
02:59
That's a typical week for my God.
03:01
You must have just crazy workflows and systems in the back end.
03:04
Yeah, we have a lot of systems.
03:06
We automate a lot of stuff.
03:07
You know, one of the key to our success, we use all offshore labor.
03:10
I've got 47 people.
03:11
I think 40 are offshore.
03:13
and we use a lot of technology, a lot of AI LED technology.
03:16
So using offshore with really good technology is hard to beat because you can deliver an awesome product at a fraction of the cost.
03:22
absolutely.
03:23
Absolutely.
03:23
And so I've learned to do that.
03:25
It's been interesting.
03:26
You know, they say there's A labor shortage.
03:28
And I don't think there really is.
03:30
I think the shortage of labor is on the part of the contractors.
03:34
They're not willing to spend the time and energy to find the people.
03:37
Can you elaborate on that?
03:38
You said they're not willing to.
03:40
I can't find a carpenter, I can't find a project manager.
03:42
Manager.
03:42
Well, they put an ad.
03:44
Indeed.
03:44
They call the guy, a week later, nobody shows up.
03:47
Duh.
03:47
Right.
03:48
we put an ad on 100 job boards plus LinkedIn.
03:51
We respond in one minute or less and put through this huge intensive, like assessments and that kind of stuff and do all the work.
03:59
And we always find great people.
04:00
But they're not willing.
04:01
I, I was just doing.
04:02
Went to a conference grant and there was like a couple.
04:05
I was like, 150 contractors here.
04:07
I said, everybody raised their hand.
04:09
That has a recruiting budget.
04:11
2.
04:11
2.
04:12
It's the most important thing you do as your team.
04:14
And nobody spends any time and energy on it.
04:16
They just complain.
04:16
It's the circumstances.
04:18
And it's not the circumstances, it's them.
04:20
Why do you think that is?
04:21
There's just so much.
04:22
There's no visibility or transparency around that.
04:25
Like nobody's forecasting for it.
04:27
Well, what happens is contractors see, you know, if you're hammer, everything's a nail, contracts, everything is a project, right?
04:33
Yep.
04:33
A.
04:34
They need a project manager.
04:35
Usually they wait way too late.
04:37
Right.
04:37
I need them in two weeks.
04:39
And it usually takes three months to find them.
04:41
If you're looking for.
04:43
And then they put an ad in.
04:44
Indeed.
04:44
And maybe 5 of the job they get a couple people that show up.
04:47
They take the best of the, you know, the best of the worst.
04:50
The guy shows up and half of them don't work out.
04:53
And whose fault's that?
04:54
It's there.
04:54
They don't, you know, they don't have an ongoing recruiting budget.
04:57
They don't go through hundreds of people to find one.
05:00
They just don't do what they need to do to find people.
05:03
And it's, it's their fault.
05:05
There's people out there.
05:05
I found 4,000 someplace, right?
05:07
Yeah.
05:08
And I don't go, my God, I have to go through 6,000 to find to 15.
05:12
I just say, okay, those are the numbers.
05:13
Let's do it.
05:14
Yeah, that's pretty insane.
05:16
Interesting.
05:18
Your presentation, your talk with the.
05:20
The two, that I guess maybe that's a good question.
05:23
Is, like, what separates the guys who raise their hands, the two.
05:27
Right.
05:28
From everybody else, apart from.
05:30
they understand the most important thing you're gonna ever do as a contractor is build a team.
05:36
Yeah.
05:36
I use Elon Musk example.
05:37
You know, you may love or hate him, but, what is his secret sauce?
05:42
He can build teams.
05:43
That is what he does really well.
05:45
He gets the best people in the world to come to work for him.
05:47
yeah.
05:48
That's why he's successful.
05:49
I mean, he's a smart guy, but it wouldn't do any good at all if he didn't have teams.
05:52
That's right.
05:53
Yeah.
05:54
And what happens to contractors is they don't understand their most important skill is the ability to build a team.
06:01
They think it's, I'm great at framing or I'm good at eos, or I.
06:05
Whatever.
06:05
And it's the team thing.
06:07
And so in this industry, gonna.
06:09
I'm gonna have a little talk.
06:10
like.
06:10
There's six myths in this industry which are total bullshit.
06:13
All right?
06:13
The first one is only recruit when you need somebody.
06:16
That is not true.
06:18
Any decent company that's doing a good job is recruiting all the time.
06:22
All right?
06:22
The next myth is, employees are expensive.
06:25
You can't make any money without employees.
06:27
The more employees you have, the more Money you make.
06:30
They're not expensive.
06:31
They're an asset.
06:31
Here's another one.
06:32
We can do the recruiting ourselves.
06:33
How hard is this?
06:34
They all suck at it.
06:35
you know, they're not good.
06:37
It's not their skill set.
06:38
Right.
06:39
And hopefully they don't do their own accounting.
06:41
they probably don't do their own electrical.
06:43
why do they think they can do their own recruiting?
06:45
a.
06:45
They don't.
06:46
They're terrible at it, and so they think they do it themselves, and they screw it up.
06:50
Another myth is recruitment in the construction industry.
06:52
That's not true.
06:53
I'll give you an example.
06:54
Let's say, looking for elections coordinator.
06:56
Right?
06:58
Wedding planners kill it.
06:59
Because think about a wedding planner.
07:01
You've got a lot of sort of, like, you got you know, the venue, the flower person, the band, the caterer.
07:07
All those kind of, you know, kind of industries.
07:10
Yeah.
07:10
They all got to show up at the right place at the right time.
07:12
They all got to get stuff done.
07:14
Everybody has to be happy.
07:15
Sounds like a Remodel to me.
07:16
And the thing is, wedding planners want to do that for a living.
07:20
That's fun for them.
07:21
the, hospitality industry doesn't have anything at all.
07:24
So we've got a lot of wedding planners just killed it.
07:27
And then the other one, this is probably the worst Higher, fast, and fire slow.
07:31
That's death.
07:32
Because they're desperate, right?
07:34
Yep.
07:35
So the first worm buy that comes along, it looks like it's not totally, except, you know, not terror.
07:41
They hire.
07:41
So they hire fast.
07:42
Bad idea.
07:43
Then they get their world's worst employee, Somebody who's not bad enough to fire or good enough to keep Purgatory.
07:49
They're terrible.
07:49
They keep them forever because they can't fire them.
07:53
Yeah, they just kill the organization.
07:55
one bad employee can wipe out your entire corporate culture.
07:57
I've seen it happen.
07:58
absolutely, absolutely.
08:00
And so what you should do is, is you hire slow.
08:04
You look for a long time to find the right person.
08:07
When I work for hundreds of contractors, how fast can you find my guy?
08:10
We need him, like two weeks.
08:12
I go, you should have started four months ago.
08:14
Yeah, right.
08:15
You hire slow, you look all the time.
08:19
And the other one, which is typical is recruiting is a project that ends.
08:23
And, you know, most contractors see recruiting as a project like a house.
08:26
You need a high, you need a whatever, a project manager.
08:29
You got a new job, you find the project manager, you stop.
08:32
Bad idea.
08:33
It's a process.
08:34
When do you stop marketing?
08:35
When it works.
08:36
So recruiting is a process.
08:39
There's another thing that I think is important for a lot of these contracts.
08:42
I'm going to say there's two type of cultures just to be, you know, bright.
08:46
One is, I call football team.
08:48
You're as good as your last season.
08:50
You're always out to perform.
08:51
Everybody on the team looks about.
08:52
It's a performance.
08:53
Everybody's got to, you know, perform or they're not going to be there.
08:56
Then there's the federal government.
08:57
Unless you screw up really bad, you stay forever.
09:00
Right?
09:00
Right.
09:01
Yeah.
09:01
So the problem is, most companies are running on the federal government model.
09:05
They just, because they don't know how to fire people, they're not willing to fire people.
09:08
They, you know, they hire slow.
09:09
I mean, hire fast and far slow.
09:11
So they get this mediocre team.
09:13
I'll tell everybody.
09:13
listening to this podcast right now.
09:15
Anybody that you wouldn't rehire immediately, you should fire.
09:18
There's always people like that.
09:19
Yeah, that's a good.
09:20
That's a, that's a good challenge.
09:22
I like that.
09:23
And so it is, you know, they create their own problem that's really interesting.
09:27
Number five on that list really hits home I think, right, in terms of just the like the reactive nature of construction too.
09:37
How do you, how do these contractors and builders.
09:40
How do you become more proactive in your hiring?
09:43
Right.
09:43
Like when you, you know that you have a project two weeks out but.
09:46
And you know that you should have been a lot more proactive.
09:49
Well, this answer simple grant.
09:51
You hire all the time.
09:52
There isn't any quality company that doesn't hire all the time in this country that I know.
09:57
Because that's just what you do.
09:59
And you also market all the time.
10:01
If you're smart, you consider yourself a marketing company that does construction.
10:04
If you're not, you can see yourself a construction company that has to spend money on marketing because they got a good client.
10:09
That, that is really, really good.
10:11
I think that that way of we're a marketing company that just happens to do construction.
10:16
Most success.
10:17
I don't care if you're looking at Costco or Amazon, Netflix.
10:21
All marketing companies, they fund their marketing with some kind of product or service.
10:25
But they're very clear, they're a marketing company.
10:27
Absolutely.
10:28
And if you could change your mind, tried and failed many times to get the contractor to say you are a marketing company that fund your marketing with construction.
10:35
But a lot of them don't see that.
10:36
They don't come from that.
10:37
It was a hard time grant for people.
10:39
Make the change from an entrepreneur, from a craftsman to an entrepreneur.
10:44
It's a different skill set, right?
10:45
absolutely.
10:46
So as a craftsman, you know, you have a sense of immediacy.
10:49
You know, you look from week to week, you just think, how do I get this thing built in a week?
10:56
I mean it's a different, it's an entrepreneur.
10:57
You think like a year ahead, you're willing to invest money that you're not going to get back for six months.
11:02
Yeah.
11:02
one of the things I try to do with a lot of contractors is I get them to work with architects.
11:06
Right.
11:07
And I just give a talk on that, you know, because the problem is, you know, architects already have a girlfriend.
11:11
It's not you.
11:12
But you shouldn't let that get in your way.
11:13
Right.
11:14
But it takes six months and six or seven meetings where they give you a job.
11:19
Most contractors don't have that patience.
11:21
And they go one or two meetings.
11:22
I ding me A job, I'm done.
11:23
Right.
11:24
They have this immediate a sense of urgency, which just doesn't serve them.
11:27
So I think that's, you know, in fact, you have time, Grant.
11:31
I will tell you exactly what they need.
11:33
Nobody's gonna do this when maybe of the people listening to this, I would say 5% will do.
11:37
I'm gonna tell them right now, and I'll tell them exactly what they need to do.
11:40
Right?
11:41
Yeah.
11:42
Sort of like, why is America fat?
11:44
I mean, what is the answer?
11:46
You eat right and you exercise.
11:47
What is the problem?
11:48
Everybody knows the answer, that people don't do it.
11:50
This is very much the same thing.
11:52
So I'll tell you exactly what you need to do to get all the quality people you need.
11:56
You ready?
11:57
I love the suspense.
11:59
Okay, first, write a job ad.
12:01
will get somebody to quit their job and come to work for you.
12:04
You don't want to hire anybody who doesn't have a job.
12:07
Now, the good news is AI can actually do that.
12:09
Chat CPT is good at it.
12:11
Yeah.
12:11
You can go to Chat GPT and say, I'm a plumbing contractor or I'm a remodeling contractor in Kansas City.
12:17
This is my market.
12:19
This is my city.
12:20
Blah, blah, blah.
12:21
Write the ad for me.
12:22
And it'll run a killer ad.
12:23
So AI is good at that.
12:25
That didn't happen two years ago.
12:26
So AI will write you the job ad.
12:28
Right?
12:28
Right.
12:28
Next you ask AI, you say, where should I post this job ad to get the biggest use of this market?
12:35
Right.
12:35
AI will give you 50 or 60 places to post, will give you trade schools.
12:40
It will outline everything you need to do and where to place that at.
12:44
But it's sort of like, well, if you want to lose weight, you can only have 2,000 calories a day.
12:48
that's exactly.
12:50
That's the way it is.
12:51
Right?
12:51
Yeah.
12:53
So it will tell you where to place all job ads.
12:55
It won't place them for you.
12:57
It won't make a decision on how much you want to spend on the ads.
13:00
It can't.
13:00
You know, it is.
13:01
thinking AI release.
13:02
What's called AI is very intelligent, but it's not wise.
13:06
The difference between intelligence and wise is intelligence is building a ship.
13:11
Wise is knowing where to go with it.
13:12
Right.
13:12
It's a different thing.
13:13
So it will tell you it's intelligent, will tell you all the place you need to post it.
13:17
It won't tell you which ones for you.
13:19
Which one shouldn't you.
13:20
That's your decision.
13:21
All right.
13:21
Yeah.
13:22
Next.
13:22
This is the hardest one that they'll never do.
13:27
Respond in real time.
13:28
yeah.
13:28
We respond to 6,000 people a week in real time.
13:31
They're not gonna do it.
13:32
And, you know, speed to lead.
13:33
Right, Grant?
13:34
You know, speed, lead.
13:35
It's true for applicants, too.
13:36
You got about a minute and then it goes.
13:38
Yeah.
13:38
right.
13:39
So if you're going your project manager, you're going through.
13:42
Indeed.
13:42
Or someplace, and you apply, nothing happens till, like, nine of the places you apply, one place gets back to you in 35 seconds.
13:49
What do you think about that?
13:50
They have their act together, right?
13:51
Yeah, absolutely.
13:52
And most contractors apply, if they're lucky, two days later or three days, it's like, doesn't work.
13:59
That's the hardest one to yourself, is to respond in real time.
14:02
And that one, you have to do that yourself.
14:04
And that's why we have, like, all these employees.
14:07
All right, next one.
14:09
A detailed skills and behavioral assessment.
14:11
I think we've got the best industry.
14:13
But you can use disc, you can use, you know, Briggs, Myers.
14:16
There's a bunch of really good assessments out there.
14:18
sure, yeah.
14:19
You've got to assess the candidate because you can't do that on an interview.
14:23
So get a really good assessment that works for you, and you've got to use it.
14:28
And we have, like, I think the best industry, but as I said, we go.
14:32
We have 6,000 applicants who do a thousand assessments.
14:35
Right.
14:36
A week of those thousand assessments, you only send video interviews to 500 of Now, the problem with assessments, Grant, is that with an assessment, you have to know how to interpret And so I suggest if you use bricks, buyers, or disc one of those, you get somebody else who knows what they're doing to interpret that assessment for you on that candidate.
14:55
That's right, yeah.
14:56
Do we have to train people how to do that?
14:58
Okay, that AI can't.
14:59
It can tell you what assessments to give.
15:01
far as interpreting the assessment, that takes.
15:03
Somebody knows what they're doing.
15:04
All right, that's the next part.
15:06
Now, once you do, you do an initial, video interview.
15:09
We do, as I said, a ton of those.
15:11
You can.
15:11
There's a lot of programs you can put it on.
15:13
They can do it on their phone, on the computer.
15:15
You have a list of questions.
15:16
We always change the questions depending on the company.
15:18
If you have a list of questions, you do a video interview, because you can find out stuff in the video interview.
15:23
You couldn't find out on the assessment.
15:26
Right?
15:27
So that's key.
15:28
So you do a video interview, and that'll allow you to understand out the things you don't understand in the assessment.
15:34
Okay.
15:34
All right, next, you do the video interview.
15:36
Zoom interview, you conduct a background check.
15:40
That is key.
15:41
All right?
15:42
You have to conduct a background check.
15:43
you can't do a background check to offer a job in some states.
15:46
Depends on the state.
15:46
State.
15:47
All right?
15:47
Got to do a background check in order to offer them a job.
15:51
and then you do.
15:52
Okay, hold on.
15:53
Hey, guys.
15:54
you do a video interview.
15:55
All right, let me get.
15:58
Hey, Lisa.
15:59
I'm recording right now.
16:02
so, A video interview, and then you do hopefully a zoom interview, because that's in person.
16:08
And then you do in person interview.
16:09
Okay?
16:10
So that's the whole system.
16:11
Once you do all that and you conduct the background checks, you call the references.
16:14
True story, Grant.
16:16
I had a guy who had a bookkeeper in Bezel, right?
16:19
It happens all the time in construction.
16:20
He called the DA and said, hey, dude, I want you to prosecute this woman.
16:24
He goes, don't you realize she got fired from her last two jobs from embezzlement?
16:29
Wow.
16:29
He never even checked it.
16:30
That's crazy, right?
16:32
Call the references.
16:33
You gotta do that.
16:34
Okay.
16:35
Now, you know, you gotta make a companion job.
16:37
AI Is good at that.
16:38
You say, do the research for a plumber in Kansas City.
16:41
Check all the, you know, website.
16:42
Tell me what do I have to offer this guy, and write the job offer for me.
16:46
It will do that.
16:47
So the AI Is good range.
16:48
I'll offer the next one is you got to have a good onboarding procedure.
16:52
Now think.
16:53
Think, Grant.
16:54
You have you changed jobs very much in your life, Grant.
16:56
You got for different jobs?
16:59
Yeah, sure.
17:00
Okay, now, remember the first day you went to work on your new job, Right?
17:03
Yeah.
17:04
You either came home with some version of these two or something in between.
17:08
You went to your wife.
17:09
Whoever it is.
17:10
my God.
17:10
This is the best decision I ever made.
17:12
I'm so happy.
17:13
Hey, dear, I think I made a mistake, Right?
17:18
It's like a first date.
17:19
You can't fix it, right?
17:21
Yeah.
17:21
You better make sure they go home and tell their spouse.
17:24
That's the best decision I ever made.
17:26
You don't want to throw them a two belt, say, we're late on this project, go out there and fix it.
17:31
So the first day is the most critical day.
17:34
You gotta fall in love with the company.
17:36
Yep.
17:36
and then you also have to fall for the onboarding.
17:38
That can take like six months.
17:40
AI is good at that.
17:40
Go to chat GPT and say, this is what I want to do.
17:43
These are.
17:44
It'll write the job description, it will write the KPIs, it will write the ad, it will write the onboarding process.
17:51
AI is good at all that stuff and I'll do it for you.
17:53
So those are things.
17:54
And there it is, guys.
17:55
Just do that and you're good.
17:56
I'll go one more time.
17:57
You're right.
17:59
Do that.
18:00
You post it everywhere.
18:01
I can tell you where to post it.
18:02
You respond to applicants in real time.
18:04
Good luck with that.
18:05
you do detailed behavioral assessments.
18:07
You do initial phone screening in person zoom interviews, conduct a background check, call references making competitive offer and do it.
18:14
Onboarding.
18:14
We're done.
18:16
Wow.
18:16
That's it.
18:17
Do you think that's why, one of the reasons why so many contractors are so reactive when it comes to hiring is because they see this as just another gigantic project.
18:29
They don't even know what they don't know.
18:31
That's the problem, Grant.
18:33
They think, I'm going to put an ad.
18:34
Indeed.
18:35
I'm going to call a couple guys and I'll find somebody.
18:37
No problem.
18:37
It doesn't work.
18:39
Yeah.
18:39
And it's like, I'm going to build a house.
18:41
I'm not going to get a permit.
18:42
I'm not going to have a set of plans.
18:44
I'll just send the guys out there and tell them I want a house that looks cool.
18:46
Let them do their That makes sense.
18:48
It doesn't work.
18:49
Yeah.
18:49
And so this, you know, if you do this, I found 4,000 people from Carpenters and they got a 94 chance of success.
18:59
So they are out there.
19:01
But unless you do all this stuff, you're never going to That makes sense.
19:04
Absolutely.
19:04
So, are with you and your team, Paul, do you guys work with really all levels of contractors and builders in a typical week?
19:13
Well, I mean, we hire everything from a lawnmower guy to a CEO.
19:17
I mean, literally carpenters, electricians, plumbers, laborers, we hire painters, all kinds of people.
19:23
We hire a lot of project managers.
19:25
We then hire, you know, bookkeepers, accounting people and you know, literally project, I mean, project managers or even, CEOs.
19:35
And CEOs.
19:36
We are anything in construction.
19:37
We're we'll hire now, there is something that's happening in industry which I'm using and I think you should listen to is what can you do offshore, right?
19:45
yeah.
19:45
So if you can, if it's a person who's like getting in touch with architects and making you look good, then that can be done offshore.
19:52
I have two full time VAs.
19:53
I've got a guy that's doing all his architecture offshore because he hired licensed architect in Columbia for eight bucks an hour and he's killing it.
20:00
Wow.
20:01
and anything bookkeeping.
20:03
I had a funny story.
20:04
I want to, I knew a person who said I can't trust people in the Philippines with my books, blah, blah, blah.
20:09
I know a guy who does exclusively for contractors.
20:12
All he does is contract.
20:13
We trust him.
20:14
Casey.
20:14
So you know, American guy in Kansas City or something.
20:19
His whole team is in the Philippines.
20:21
So, I mean, I read some statistic that 20% of.
20:26
Of jobs are done offshore.
20:27
Crazy number in the U.S.
20:29
I believe it.
20:30
Yeah.
20:30
I believe that.
20:31
But you've got, I mean, so we can tap into that.
20:33
So if you're smart, you'll recruit all the time, you'll go offshore if it makes any economic sense.
20:39
I.
20:39
I just hired a marketing person.
20:40
She kills it.
20:41
I think, I mean she does all my, my videos.
20:44
She does all kind of stuff for me.
20:45
And I think it's what she charged.
20:46
don't know.
20:47
She does get a great job.
20:48
I have two full time VAs.
20:50
So I have one woman in Nigeria that doesn't tries to look up contractors.
20:54
So.
20:55
And the thing is, they have a great work ethic.
20:57
They just do.
20:57
Because that's the way they were brought up.
21:00
Right.
21:00
It's just different.
21:01
yeah.
21:02
So same thing too, right?
21:04
Like, you know, if, your contractor is interested in jumping, getting a VA to help, you know, you could go the same route as the six.
21:13
Six little steps that you.
21:15
Or six now va.
21:17
Offshore is a little harder.
21:18
We have to go through 600 to a thousand people to find one because we get 50, 50 applicants a day.
21:24
Wow.
21:24
And the sorting process is huge and we're looking all over the world.
21:27
So the numbers are just crazy, right?
21:28
yeah.
21:29
It's not like looking for a, you know, carpenter in Kansas City.
21:32
Yeah.
21:33
Numbers are a lot worse in a sense But if you play the numbers, it always works.
21:37
Are you seeing that just like the, the attraction to getting more bas, especially with, you know, Back end operations and streamlining marketing.
21:47
Are you seeing that?
21:48
Just kind of on the rise with.
21:50
Yeah, I mean, it's.
21:51
I think it's going to take off because when you think about it, offshore people, there's now a way to find them.
21:56
Right.
21:56
Because there's.
21:58
Everything's worldwide in the country, in the world.
22:00
Yeah.
22:01
There's a way to vet them, which you know how to do that.
22:03
And there's.
22:04
They have the tools.
22:05
I mean, they've got all access, the same AI I do.
22:07
Right?
22:08
Yeah.
22:08
So you've got a video editor in the Philippines that has all the most sophisticated video editing tools.
22:15
Right.
22:16
And she's six bucks an hour and kills it.
22:18
That's awesome.
22:19
So I think they just have to get on board.
22:22
I have a sort of a funny, thing, you know, private equity is now coming to construction.
22:26
Private, right.
22:27
yeah.
22:28
Okay.
22:28
So, why do you think private equity is coming in construction?
22:31
It's a great question.
22:32
Just because It.
22:32
It's.
22:33
Well, one, it's growing like crazy.
22:35
Two, there's the.
22:37
It's one of the, the areas that AI can't necessarily touch as much.
22:41
Right.
22:42
If you have hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars and you were investing in information from any kind of things, it could have been movies, it could have been attorneys, it could have been doctors, whatever.
22:51
AI is just disrupting all those industries.
22:54
Yeah.
22:54
And so where are you going to put your money?
22:56
I was listening to podcasts and guy said he was like a guru in AI said, what'd you tell your son to do?
23:00
He said, become a plumber.
23:01
Right.
23:02
Because that industry is going So all this hundreds and hundreds of millions or billions is coming into the construction industry that's doing a couple things.
23:09
Sort of the good news and the bad news.
23:10
The good news is the multiple your company has gone through the ceiling.
23:15
Like you took a percentage of it.
23:16
I've got plumbing companies are doing like 10 times EBITDA.
23:18
like crazy numbers.
23:19
Right.
23:20
Wow.
23:20
Because people are just spending cash.
23:22
The bad news, if they don't buy you, they put you out of business because they got way more cash than you do, way more systems than you do.
23:28
And it's called the Walmartization.
23:30
You know, I remember, I enjoy old enough news, but used to be downtowns.
23:33
It had like a drugstore department, all these little stores.
23:37
Right.
23:37
They couldn't find people.
23:38
They complained the customers were paying the blah, blah, blah.
23:41
Right.
23:42
Somebody has a Walmart outside of town somewhere.
23:44
They find 500 people somewhere, right?
23:46
Yeah.
23:47
And they have marketing system and they just suck all the work out because they're better at it.
23:52
yeah.
23:53
You know, it's better, cheaper, faster.
23:56
And so what happens is, I mean, why did it buy stuff from Amazon?
23:59
Because you can get it as cheap and it's fast.
24:01
Why is Because they, it's tough for those people to compete.
24:05
So if you're in the construction industry, sign on, get a marketing company, get a recruiting company.
24:10
The good news is use AI if you use the systems, there's a bit of a leveler there.
24:16
You can have the same access to systems that they do, but do not try.
24:20
You know, it's like I'm going to use a newspaper to find somebody.
24:22
Just kidding.
24:22
But it's like, you know, it doesn't work anymore, right?
24:25
Yeah, absolutely.
24:27
So it's important in this time in the construction industry that you use the technology, use the systems and their marketing.
24:34
There's a lot of really good people out there that aren't that expensive like us because we, I mean we're as good as recruiting for a fortune founder company because you know what the hell we're doing.
24:41
And we're cheap because we're using an offshore so that it's possible for the small guy to still compete.
24:48
But he's got to get on the ball and use those kind of resources.
24:51
That makes perfect sense.
24:52
So at what point should a contractor reach out to you?
24:54
know when they're, when they're thinking through their hiring strategy or when, you know, I guess, well, any contractor that wants to hire people should call us.
25:03
I mean literally we have like 800 contracts to do with.
25:07
They're all between probably a million and 15 million.
25:12
Once you get to 30 or 40 million, you build your own HR department.
25:15
That's right, yep.
25:16
And you, you do all this stuff.
25:17
You don't.
25:17
That's what works, right.
25:19
People hire franchises because they've got HR departments and they got marketing departments.
25:23
when, when you're a small guy, you don't have those systems.
25:26
You hire people like us.
25:27
I've literally hired people that are just starting a business because they, they're smart enough to say, I talked to a guy, he said, well, I said, he as I 10 or 20m million do something.
25:36
I'm going to start a roofing company, Nebraska.
25:38
Why?
25:38
He says, well, easy, first place.
25:41
I know marketing I can help you do.
25:44
You can do recruiting.
25:44
I Understand business.
25:46
How hard is roofing?
25:47
I can figure that out.
25:48
And all those guys are sort of suck.
25:49
I mean, I will be the best roofing company in Nebraska in three years.
25:53
Amazing.
25:54
Because they've got the systems, right?
25:56
Yep.
25:56
So all those little guys that are trying to follow, they're going to be gone.
25:59
Because he knows how to recruit people, how to market, how to deliver great product at a great price, uses technology.
26:06
He's got all those systems.
26:07
And unless you want to sign on board with that, you're in trouble.
26:10
Yep.
26:11
Yeah.
26:11
100.
26:12
I love.
26:13
See, I mean I'm a big proponent of it, so I love seeing that trend.
26:17
I think it's fascinating how that that is taken off just right.
26:22
It's like a great opportunity.
26:24
I say they're going to buy you for a ton of money or put you out of business.
26:27
You make your choice.
26:28
Yeah.
26:28
100.
26:30
Yeah.
26:30
Well, Paul, this was a.
26:31
This was a killer conversation.
26:32
I love hearing about like the, the steps and just learning more about, you know, why it's so important to get that speed to lead up, especially for guys who, you know, really struggle with it, which is everybody.
26:44
how can guys like get a hold of you and, and learn more?
26:48
Contractor staffing source.
26:49
All right, and there's a big button that says appointment with Paul.
26:53
I still sell because what the hell is what I do, right?
26:56
so go to contractor staffing source and there's a button that says appointment with Paul 15 minutes.
27:02
Click on that button and they get on my calendar.
27:03
I have to talk to him about it.
27:04
That's all I have Good for you too.
27:06
Like how big you guys are and you're still taking on those calls.
27:10
That's that.
27:10
I mean it's my folks.
27:11
I didn't have.
27:12
I've had to work for years.
27:13
But what am I going to do for fun?
27:14
Right?
27:15
Yeah, I love.
27:17
No, I really love it.
27:18
I mean that's, I do it for.
27:20
My most fun I have Is selling contractors.
27:22
That's my.
27:22
It's my favorite.
27:23
I mean I play golf, all those things.
27:25
But I love it.
27:26
That's why I'm never going to quit.
27:27
It's fun.
27:28
man, that's amazing.
27:30
Good for you.
27:30
But well, hey, I really appreciate you jumping on hope.
27:34
Hopefully people listen will actually do some of that stuff.
27:36
I mean.
27:36
Yeah.
27:36
When you wanna you know exactly how to do.
27:39
Either hire us to do it or do it yourself, but admit you're the problem.
27:42
And I always said.
27:43
I think Jim Rohn said this.
27:44
You always got to work harder on yourself than you do on your business.
27:46
100%.
27:48
Yeah.
27:49
If you're willing to do this, you can solve your recruiting problem.
27:52
Absolutely.
27:52
Good stuff.
27:53
Well, hey, like I said, you know, great conversation.
27:56
I really appreciate being here.
27:57
I really hope some people listen and we can change some flies with this.
27:59
That'd be great.
28:00
Absolutely.
28:01
That's the goal.
28:02
But you enjoy the rest of your day, and we'll chat soon.
28:04
Thanks.
28:04
I appreciate it.
28:05
Look, my entire mission with this series is to see talented builders and business owners stop getting run over by operational chaos and to actually start building the business they deserve.
28:17
If this episode gave you even one tool or 1% of a tool to fight back, please share it with a fellow builder.
28:23
Help me spread the word.
28:24
That is all I ask, so make sure you subscribe so you're ready for the next one.
28:28
Until then, systems scale your success.
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