Estie Briggs | Systematizing your Crew's EQ

Soft skills don't cost you 150 grand when a project manager quits in the middle of your job.

Here's the reality.

You track your lumber and concrete to the penny, but you treat your crew's behavior like a lottery ticket.

We hire for hard skills.

Can they build?

Can they use job tread?

But we fire for behavior.

The yelling matches the panic parties during change orders.

That isn't just the drama.

That is an operational failure.

That is destroying your bottom line.

So today I'm sitting down with Estie Briggs, founder of Briggs Performance Consulting.

She's an EQ coach, speaker, and author.

We aren't talking about feelings.

We're talking about the stoplight protocol that predicts crew burnout before it happens and how you can use AI to coach your team's decision making automatically.

So if you're tired of losing margin to personality clashes, this episode turns those problems into a process you can actually fix.

Let's get Beyond the Bid.

You're listening to Beyond the Bid, the show by GO First, where we share the systems, strategies and practical AI for builders.

Keep listening to learn how to win more of the right projects, boost profitability and scale.

Beyond the Bid.

Thanks so much for being here.

Estie.

Welcome to be all.

Really appreciate you being here.

Thanks, Grant.

It's good to see you.

It's been fun watching what you're doing.

I know we're both in the AI connection, so shout out to that community too.

actually that's a good idea.

I'll drop the AIX link in the show notes.

that's a super cool community.

just for those who don't know, that's like a great group, I think.

Rachel Wood started it.

Right.

But we meet every Friday just chatting about what's going on in the world of AI and how I always learn something new.

Yeah, yeah.

but today I'm pretty stoked because we're going to be talking about just like emotional intelligence, which I think is especially in construction.

It's just like this totally underserved concept for 99.9999 of businesses.

you're comfortable with it, Estie could you kind of just give a quick 30 second overview of who you are and what you do?

Sure, yeah.

Thanks for asking.

Thanks for having me on the show too.

Yeah.

I'm an emotional intelligence coach and I also do public speaking on range of topics.

But I love talking about eq.

It's near and dear to me and I work with companies and teams to help them develop the skills that basically build better human interaction.

So it doesn't matter what industry you're in.

Everybody's had the experience of working with somebody that they didn't enjoy being around and that (MAP) delivered feedback in an awful way or showed up.

there's a million ways to illustrate what poor EQ or low EQ looks like.

But I work with people judgment free.

My thing is curiosity over judgment.

I really am passionate about helping them understand what emotional intelligence is because it If you've never heard of it, it sounds very like woo, woo, or not something that you would expect to be discussed on the job site.

But a great example of it is, working for somebody who, when they're pissed off and they're yelling at people and they're throw their hammer across the job site or whatever.

And this is actual experience stories that I've heard, versus somebody who can say, you know what, this isn't working right now, let's take a step back.

let's look at the situation rationally.

Instead of reacting, let's be responsive.

you said it's an underserved industry.

When it comes to eq, it's a high risk industry and our emotions drive so much of our behavior that we're not even aware of.

So I love just opening up that toolkit for people because it literally is another set of tools for people to use, again regardless of industry.

But right alongside whatever, hard skills or technical skills you've had to learn in the trades, this is another set of skills that can help differentiate people 100%.

I actually had a conversation with someone yesterday at just like a meetup group and he just larger enterprise companies evaluate risk for cyber security and all different types of risk.

And it's like actually emotional intelligence is one of those, if you think about it, because it's like almost identifying better ways how people can communicate, better ways of people working together.

because without that it's like, you know, you're just trying to adapt a little bit, you know, without the right tool.

Yeah, 100%.

it's essential to have psychological safety on the work site, you know, on the job site.

And if people aren't familiar with that term, it's the ability to feel like you can safely raise your hand and say, this doesn't look right or I think I might have a better way of doing this.

And in the companies that encourage that, that's great.

But in the companies that don't see the value in it or have been historically just very top down with their authority structure, it can result in a lot of really scary things happening.

You know, besides the fact that people probably don't really enjoy going to work every day, depending, I mean, it depends.

And again, curiosity over judgment.

so we weren't born with these skills.

We got conditioned and learned from our parents and from other bosses over the years.

And so a lot of us, a lot of my clients especially, like, they'll beat themselves up and be like, God, I can't believe I'm showing up like this to my crew or whatever.

okay.

You start where you're at and then you figure out which skills you want to build on and you work on it a little bit at a time.

Just like anything.

You can't learn it overnight, but you can learn it.

It's not a fixed set of skills.

totally.

I think that's one of the biggest things too is, you know, just getting like a diagnostic or an assessment of you know, literally how you work and how you think because you Might have, like, your own heuristics or your own biases around literally yourself.

Totally.

And you've got, you know, everybody.

You don't even know others.

But Having just like, one objective report that's like, okay, here's, you know, more context, here's more information to go off of is valuable.

Yeah.

The clients that you've worked with so far, After they've kind of gotten the assessments, those diagnostics for, we'll say, like their team, what are some of, like, the best practices of how they use it?

Yeah, that's a great question.

one of the things I'll have people do often is just reflect back on the week.

every week, there's something called the mood meter, for example, that I introduce early on.

Have you heard of that?

I haven't, so it's just a tool that you can use.

the first foundational tool in emotional intelligence is just self awareness, just being aware of what you're feeling and that you're even feeling something.

Because so many of us have been taught that emotions are, you know, inconvenient, and we need to just push them out, you know, leave them outside of the door when we come to work.

And that actually doesn't serve us very well because we're human and they don't.

It's not something we can separate from us.

And so the mood meter, which I can show later, it's basically a tool that can help you identify what you're feeling.

And it's based on these two axes.

Axis, however you pronounce it of, whether you're feeling high or low energy, and then unpleasant or pleasant emotions.

And if you're feeling unpleasant and high energy, you're probably in the red zone.

And each block has a color.

Sure.

and the red zone is where you get hijacked and you don't want.

You can't.

You're not the best version of yourself.

And so one of the great things that teams can do, even on just a daily basis, is just check in with everybody and be like, where are you at today?

And depending on, again, the level of psychological safety, people might not be comfortable saying, I'm feeling really overwhelmed, actually, or or whatever.

But even just as simple as being like, kind of in the red zone, or I'm kind of in the blue zone, which is low energy and low pleasantness, just building that dialogue and Building.

Making it normal to talk about how you're feeling Is huge.

And then there's other exercises that people can do.

I think for teams and for practical things, just normalizing, talking about what you're feeling and then getting better at naming it.

I call it Name it to tame it.

So you know you're feeling something, but you're like, I don't know what that is.

Whatever, I'm just going to get on with my day.

But if you can actually pause and inquire, like, okay, what am I feeling?

Why am I feeling that?

I've been doing this a lot lately.

it takes your brain out of the fight or flight.

And The scientific term is affective labeling.

if you can get yourself to pause and name what you're feeling, just that act actually takes you out of your fight or flight mode and into your prefrontal cortex, which is where we make good decisions and where we do choose the best response to.

To things.

That's amazing.

Yeah, it's.

Yeah.

I was actually listening to.

It's not easy because we're just on autopilot.

You know, as humans, we just want to take the path of least resistance.

I was listening to a YouTube video about sales a few days ago, and he was talking about, it was actually sales for, like, designers and artists and how important like.

He was actually a proponent of meditation because it helps you kind of get out of that reactive state and like you said, kind of evaluate why you're feeling a certain way.

Cool.

That's funny.

Yeah.

I mean, It does, it relates.

When I first learned about eq, it It wasn't until I was in my 40s and I was taking a class there's a class on coaching and how to coach others.

And we took this assessment and it was basically an EQ assessment.

And then we had to have 10 other people that have worked with us answer the same questions.

So it was like I was assessing myself.

Kind of like the assessment that I sent you that we're going to take a look at.

Yeah.

I self assessed in all these different categories and then.

But the act of having to read how other people experience me was a real reality check because it's, you know, it's one thing to think that we show up a certain way, but it's another thing to find out how other people see us or how other people experience us.

that's crazy.

It's huge.

Yeah.

Was there anything that really like, stood out to you in terms of like things that you weren't expecting I mean 10 people.

That's a lot too.

That's so much data from other people's perspectives, right?

Yeah.

The thing that stood out for me at the time, I was a leader of a team and I saw that people experienced me as being indecisive and overly flexible and overly empathetic and that was all true.

Like if you look at eq, my flexibility, it's really high.

My empathy is really high.

My And these are all I'm listing these things.

These are all different, you know, EQ skill sets.

They fall into different categories.

there's different tools out there I use.

The one that I use is from mhs, which is a, you know, it's a science backed vetted tool.

like.

Yeah, okay, thank you.

I had people share and they had an open question.

They had like an open ended question that they could answer.

And a lot of people on my team said that they wished that I would be more decisive.

And I was like, okay, like, you know, that's good feedback.

I mean, feedback's not always easy to receive, but it was all anonymous, so I didn't know who said what.

Which is why you want as many people as possible so that you can, you can get a collective sort of data set instead of just two or three people.

when it pinpoints like that, you know, it's like, nails it.

It's like, okay, I know now what to do with this information exactly.

You know, it's like, wish you did X, Y and Z.

And then from somebody else it's like, I wish you did everybody, because nothing's really trending here.

Yeah.

But yeah, that's fascinating.

Have you like been able to run that same concept with other teams or other 360s?

people are scared of the 360s.

It's funny, I've only done a few.

That's called a360, which, when you get other people to take the same assessment, haven't run as many of Them as I would like to.

because when I present it as an option it's usually to, you know, the CEO or the decision maker and they don't necessarily want to know what everybody thinks, short answer is I haven't done as many as I think could be beneficial.

but I have done a few and people found them really And also if anybody's ever had a 360 or even had a crappy performance review, getting feedback that tells you that you're not doing a good job is painful.

And so nobody's going to opt in to that.

So people see the benefit of it.

This is just like you said, it's a diagnostic.

I love that term.

It's like this is how people experience you and what do we do with that information moving forward?

the end of the world.

It's just information and if you do take it and you do work with it, you're going to grow.

Growth never comes from comfortable places.

Yeah.

I hope more people jump on board.

I agree.

You know, I'm sure it's uncomfortable 100%.

It's a very vulnerable place.

Yeah.

is it that you want to have rate you see like you have to come up with your list and I help people decide who their raters should be and want it to be a balanced set of people report, Everybody's in a different position.

Like now I'm self employed so don't know who I would give it to if I had to do a 360.

yeah, especially if I was a foreman or supervisor or superintendent or anybody that was in charge of other people, I would give it to your clients.

I wonder how that would go.

yeah, they could provide feedback on the services that you're providing.

Yeah, it's very meta.

Yeah.

How do I feel about how you feel about it?

in my industry there's just, you know, it's 100% needed like in terms of.

it's like anything else.

Implementation is the hardest part.

The idea Estie, you know, there's so much value in the idea, but the real meat of it comes with implementation and the rollout.

What do I do with it?

Yeah, like I said, like if you get a crappy performance review.

It's usually, you know, they tell you all the things you're doing wrong and then you both sign it and then you both go back to your day or whatever.

It's really about what do you do to change the behavior.

It's not about the data.

It's like, what do you do with the data?

like, you gotta take that and put it into a roadmap and make it consistent.

A coaching plan Yeah, exactly.

so, yeah, I guess in terms of (MAP) we can talk a little bit more about your process I know we can use me test case on here.

Beta I don't like to say more about the actual assessment and then the process, that you deploy to.

I'd be happy to.

I can end up administering the eqi, assessment in a number of different ways.

My least favorite way to do it is to do it purely as a transactional thing.

But I'll do it.

If people say, hey, I want to take one, they'll pay me, I'll give them the link, we'll do the debrief, and then I don't hear from them again.

But what I prefer to do is I have an EQ masterclass that I run, and I haven't actually run one since last year, but it's part of a cohort.

So you get your assessment and then a little bit to take the assessment.

You basically just get a link and you've done this.

You click on the link and you answer several questions.

Several of them feel redundant because they answer, they ask the same question different ways to make sure that you're giving, you know, that you're answering honestly and not aspirationally, as and.

And then I get the report or the diagnostic.

You know, it's like when you take your car to the mechanic and you get the feedback and then you get the report.

Nobody else sees it but you and.

But if you're in a group of people, the real power is first we've introduced the topics.

So usually in the EQ masterclass, by the time you take your assessment, you've at least learned what the different skill sets are and what they look like.

And we talk about look like in real life when they're not in balance.

And we'll talk about that when I, when I pull up your assessment about how important it is to find, Find the Areas that are off balance.

So for example, my flexibility was off balance with my assertiveness was really low in flexibility.

I mean, it was high in flexibility, but low in assertiveness.

Makes sense.

And so people can then look at their assessment and get an idea for where they're strong or where they (MAP) have some work to do.

And a high score isn't necessarily good and a low score isn't necessarily bad.

Despite what we've been conditioned to believe, which is that you got to get high scores on everything or you know, know, or you're not succeeding.

It's not that it's really about the balance.

And I mean, yeah, you want to be somewhere in the mid range in general, but it's not like you have to strive to get the highest score in every set of skills.

and so people will look at it and go through their assessment on their own again.

Nobody else has to see their, they don't have to share their scores or anything.

And then they just pick like, what's an area that you want to work on?

Nice.

And how can we support you in that?

And ideally we've got like 12 people in a cohort.

I've done it for as few as three or four.

And, and then we, and then that's when the magic happens.

Because it's not about me teaching you something, it's about you taking this information and figuring out, what you want to do with it.

Yeah.

And if you're surrounded by a group of peers that are also working on it and also having these conversations in this, like, safe space space, you can really talk about what it looks like on the job site when you, you know, when these skills are on paper, it's one thing, but when you're on the job site and you're handling stressful situations or giving somebody feedback or you're recovering from a, you know, something unfortunate that happened and now you've got to like talk to your team about it.

That's where it kicks in.

That's where these skills are.

What you need to pull out in addition to whatever else is, is in your toolkit.

And then at the end of the boot camp or the master class, they take it again.

So we go through this 12 week event together and then you can reassess and just see, you know, if you've been actively working on some of these things, you should, you should see a change in your scores ideally.

that's super cool.

Wow.

That's the, I mean, that's the point.

It's not to just Find out whether you passed or failed.

Have you had people retake or any interest in, like, retaking that, too, like, time and time again?

Yeah, every three years or one year or whatever it is.

Yeah.

In fact, I recommend it.

I mean, I should.

If I was a better salesperson, I'd be reaching out to my previous clients and saying, hey, you want to do an eq?

You know, tune up, check in, and just see where things are and what.

What would be helpful for you to learn right now?

Because it's a.

You can go down a rabbit hole on every single one of the skill sets.

There's different strategies that you can do to either build them up or.

Or dial it back sometimes, depending on which of the skill sets it is.

I mean, even, you know, everybody's got just huge projects on their plate.

Like, my gosh, the stress.

I know.

Yeah.

And it's like, this is just.

At its core, it's another.

Gets you out of that, like, old story, that old way of thinking about that, those projects and, you know, helps you, like, really refine your strengths, but also reevaluate the areas of opportunity.

Yeah, yeah.

And also think about what it looks like, you know, how other people experience you is not something that we get invited to do or even that we want to do all the time, because we're just in our heads, you know?

or at least I am.

I mean, I don't.

You know, they say you can't read the label from inside the jar.

You could have somebody else point it out to you sometimes.

And believe me, I'd much rather have me do it than most other, like, you know, I don't know, supervisors or foremen that I've met.

Yeah.

yeah.

So I try to be gentle but truthful.

Yeah, no, I think it's.

That's tremendous.

But, yeah, I think you should be able to share your screen.

If you can't, just let me know and I can share it online.

Okay.

So I will, Let's see.

Window.

just share the entire screen.

I have your assessment here that I sent you.

Can you see that?

let me actually turn it on.

Here we go.

Man, it's crazy.

That's already.

That was January 7th.

I feel like.

I know.

my gosh, so much has happened.

That's life, you know?

So would you, like, what would be most beneficial?

I don't want to bore people too much.

Like, I don't want people to feel like they're sitting through a class.

No, yeah, I just, like.

So, just for context, like, yeah, you offered to send me the assessment, I guess right before the holidays.

And it took me (MAP) an hour and a half, to.

To fill it out just because I really wanted to spend.

Be honest with it and spend time on it.

and then I think the next day or something, you sent me this, and I was kind of blown away by it.

Like, just the level of detail in this report is pretty remarkable.

And it's not really templated.

Really.

Like, no, this is the only templated part, actually.

Yeah, this is.

So this is the model, and I was mentioning all these different skill sets that I was rattling off earlier.

They.

Basically, those are the, the skills that make up emotional intelligence.

And, and they fall into five categories, and within each category there's these three subscales, and I always start with self awareness, as I mentioned.

So, they're all.

I mean, they're all equally important, but self awareness is the foundation of it all.

Because if you're not aware of what you're feeling or, you know, why you're feeling certain ways or, or how you're.

How what you're feeling is affecting your behavior, then that's always where you want to start.

Because then all of these other things are much easier to work on or, or, you know, either build or, like I said, dial back.

Yeah.

yeah.

So I can also send you a, one pager that.

That describes what all these are if you want to share that.

Sure, yeah.

And then what you got back after answering, Most people take like 20 minutes.

So when I saw how long you took, I was like, what.

What are you doing, Grant?

But, okay, so what you get back is this like, like, I love the term diagnostic.

I'm totally going to start using that.

this gives you an overall EI or EQ score.

And so up at the top is like your, Your baseline, your overall eq.

And then each of the subsections are broken down here and the five different categories.

Within those five different categories, each of the subscales gets scored, and the score represents how frequently and how easy it is for you to use these skills.

So again, it's not good or bad, it's just how.

How easy is it for you to use these skills?

And people like to immediately look at their lowest score and go, yeah, I mean, it's just human nature.

but what I invite people to look for when we're first unpacking it is where are things out of balance?

And so, yes, you want to see, like, okay, for example, your problem solving skill set is on the lower end compared to your other skills.

So then the question is, okay, well, ideally, what should that be in balance with?

And each of these skill sets has its own, dedicated page.

And these get into very specific.

Here's your problem solving one.

This gets into.

It gives you detailed feedback based on how you answered the assessment.

Totally.

And like you said, when.

When we did your, we did the debrief for you last week, you were like, my God, this is so accurate.

And it's like, yes, this is.

I experienced this.

When emotions are involved, it's difficult to problem solve.

Yeah.

and make decisions.

And the part that I think is the most.

If.

If nothing else, I would say the thing that you want to keep in mind is that ultimately you want to have things be as in balance as possible.

And so problem solving.

Your problem solving score gets compared to other subscales.

in this case, they compared it to reality testing.

And reality testing is an interesting one because reality testing is.

I like to compare that to, like, the story of Chicken Little or Chicken Little's running around.

He's like, the sky is falling.

The reality testing is the ability to not get wrapped into that, story.

Exactly.

Yeah.

And not join the panic party, as I call it.

Like, not every.

You don't have to accept the invitation to the panic party every time.

So if you can be the person in the room that's like, okay, well, let's just get the facts first.

Which it looks like you.

That's one of your higher scores.

so you might be really good at calming things down and getting rational, but then finding the problem solution isn't necessarily your strength.

So it's like, okay, so what do I do with that information?

and then it'll give you details here.

So it says, to balance this area, recognize these different situations and act accordingly.

So.

So it's giving you strategies you can try the next time you find yourself in that situation.

And what I'll tell people is just work on one thing at a time so you get your assessment, you look at your scores, and it's not something that you're going to adjust overnight.

So if you just want to work on your problem solving, then (MAP) challenge yourself to practice these strategies that it gives you.

Totally.

Yeah.

And then I'll also.

Usually if I'm working with somebody, like, I'll do my own.

I've got my own, like, toolkit that I've been adding to over the years that any other outside sources I have that are related to these skills like assertiveness or empathy.

I've got a ton of content that I'll, I'll pull out and send to people so that they've got some additional resources.

So the report by itself is a great resource and it's like I said, it's very scientifically backed and vetted and everything.

but I'll also send people resources, whether it's like podcasts or books or articles related to that topic that they're trying to work on.

That's super cool.

It's like an interactive swipe file in real time.

you know, problem solving.

here's a podcast, here's an article, here's stuff I've collected on that topic.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah.

That's super neat.

I'd love to figure out.

go ahead.

Sorry.

I think I was.

We were kind of work.

When we were working through this last week, I think I dropped it in a notebook LM and was able just to like, you know, add in my resume, my LinkedIn like, yeah.

Projects and be like, you know, based off of all of this context.

If I give it my.

The projects I'm actively working on, it can help me even, you know, refine those strategies or those action items.

my gosh.

Yeah, here's what I'm working on today, you know.

Yeah, I was just going to say I think it would be awesome to figure out how to integrate AI with some of this.

I've been working on that also.

Like I have a whole notion database with all of different skill sets and like that's where I go to pull my different resources depending on what people, people want to work on.

But the idea of making it, you know, putting it in notebook LM and, and adding other tools is also a great idea.

I love that.

I don't think they'll ever be anything that beats like an in person or even, you know, just like a peer group.

Like AI will never be able to get to that level of I don't even know what it's called.

Just.

I hate the word mastermind, but it is, you know, it's like you can only get so far with AI.

but in terms of just what's off the shelf, it's really pretty remarkable.

Just taking this crazy valuable data set and compiling it with other data about yourself.

It's awesome.

That sounds really powerful.

I'm going to do that.

Actually.

I haven't done that, taken my own EQ in a while, so.

Probably do that too.

Yeah.

And even, you know, like, with relationships with it, you know.

my gosh.

Professional being able to do that same thing.

Right?

Like.

Yeah.

See the overlay between the two?

Like where, you know, where, where do we, where do we have the same, like results and where, where are we differing 100%.

Yeah.

I had one guy.

When you said relationships, it just reminded me of a client that I had who had his flexibility was like down at like 68 or something.

It was just really.

He really had a hard time.

He was not the type to go with the flow.

He was retired military, very, you know, traditional top down.

Yeah.

Also very low impulse control.

So it's also down around like 68 or 69.

So hard time keeping his emotions under control, low empathy.

And then his assertiveness and his independence were like, up over here.

sure.

And he was like, my God, I wish I'd had this tool set before my divorce.

It's really what, at the end of the day, it's about what, how we're showing up as humans and how we're interacting with each other.

And that's why, you know, like you said in the beginning, to take it back full circle.

It is an underserved industry when it comes to this stuff.

Like if you're in tech, you probably get offered workshops like this all the time.

I would guess, I don't know.

But you know, I was in the more I was in financial services and we didn't.

Some self awareness type of exercises or leadership development programs, for example, were very abundant and available and, and in the trades and in construction specifically.

It's not as normalized to do this kind of stuff.

But I would argue that it's even more important because if you're in tech, you're not in a risky environment or financial services, you know, it's not like a.

People are going to get injured if something gets screwed up.

But you know, if you're in a culture where that's.

And that's a whole nother thing, we could talk to another episode on.

Yeah, the group report.

So if you have a team, you can get a report that shows where everybody's at collectively and then you can get some real insights to say, okay, well you know, as a team or as a company, you know, we really want to, we value, you know, our company values, you know, empathy, for example, or, or people.

And it's like, well, do you like, is it showing up here?

And if it's not, then what are the specific behaviors that would move that dial?

That's amazing.

Yeah, it's like the, the values that you've written on the wall, are they actually showing up in the day to day work?

Yeah, I love doing values work with organizations too, because it's another one scale.

it just makes so much sense, you know, like the people that you work with every single day.

You should have an idea of, you know, not just strengths, but also, you know, all of this too.

There's just so much value that comes in.

Kind of helps even like you evaluate how to write an email, take your time.

Pause.

I had had a client who was like, that was exactly the thing she worked on was, I'm gonna, I'm gonna pause and have somebody else read my emails if I'm in an emotional state before I hit send, you know, now we have chat GPT to do that for us, but totally, yeah.

AI.

yeah, I mean, I think it's really up to the, the person to decide what, you know, what they want to work on and how they want to implement that.

But this is a really valuable tool for finding out what's under the hood.

Excuse me.

Sd.

This is awesome.

And I really hope more people, dive into this concept because we need it, everybody needs it.

but how can, people, like learn more about it, get connected with you?

I would love to.

First of all, you know, like I said, I don't like to do them as just one off transactions, but I don't.

I'm not doing this podcast so that everybody can like hire me to come do workshops for them.

But if you want to do a workshop or join one of my boot camps, or my master classes, by all means, please connect I mentioned that I would be glad to offer your listeners a discount.

So, so I'll give you a code.

If anybody would like to just take their EQ assessment and see, see what their scores are, you can make an appointment with me.

And I shared my calendly link I'm on LinkedIn.

I'm in the process of rebuilding my website.

So I don't have a website to point people at.

but yeah, there's LinkedIn.

Or just make an appointment to chat with me.

I'd love to talk with you and help, Help people be better Absolutely.

None of us get it right.

I'm, I, I don't get it right all the time.

You know, even though I teach it, I'm still working on it, so.

Still human.

No shame.

Yeah, I love that.

Well, thank you so much for coming on.

I really enjoy.

And thank you so much for.

For that report that.

Yeah.

I'm glad you opened a great conversation.

So, yeah, it.

It's.

I know it's going to help me a lot just in terms of, like, the immediate value and then, you know, the dividends.

but, yeah, I hope you, enjoy the rest of your day.

And thanks so much for coming up.

Thanks, Gret.

Yep.

Bye.

Bye.

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